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    80/10/10

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    nbloch64

    Posts : 35
    Join date : 2009-07-07
    Location : Denver, CO

    80/10/10

    Post  nbloch64 on Tue Jul 14, 2009 12:53 pm

    The dogs are starting their second week of raw and only eating chicken backs and boneless, skinless breast meat right now. They did eat 2 eggs last week as well. I want to ensure I am providing the proper portions of meat, bone and organ, although I have not introduced organ yet and don't plan on it for at least another week. I am trying to be as organized as I can with them so I have created excel spreadsheets with their appropriate percentages and I have made tabs for the different types of chicken parts I can feed them. I am currently calculating the 80/10/10 (w/out organ) based on daily intake and their stools and weight seem to be doing great. However, I want to ensure this is the appropriate method of feeding and I am not overdoing any particular part of their meal. I found that my golden probably needs to have backs twice a day every other day with breast meat at both meals and on other days he gets one back in the morning with breast meat and only breast meat at dinner. My border collie mix gets a back in the morning with breast meat and only breast meat in the evening. I know their stools will let me know if something needs to be increased or reduced, but am I providing the proper nutrition by following this feeding schedule?

    Thank you,

    Nicole
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    Heather

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    Join date : 2009-02-17
    Age : 30
    Location : O'Fallon, MO

    Re: 80/10/10

    Post  Heather on Tue Jul 14, 2009 10:56 pm

    Nicole,
    It's not as difficult as you think. I calculate 10% of my dog's total food for the week and feed organ on Sunday. I don't measure it out each day or do any kind of spreadsheet. It's balance over time. It doesn't have to be perfect by any means. Really, the 80/10/10 "rule" means feed mostly meat, some bone and some organ. It's a flexible diet. I don't even feed the recommended amounts for my dog anymore. I look at his weight and if he's alittle bit chunky then he eats light ie a few anchovies or an egg. If he needs to put on a pound or so then he gets a chunk of mutton or venison Sometimes he gets a gorge meal and doesn't eat for a day and the next day eats light. It's not set in stone.. but a more relaxed approach comes with time.


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    steviesun

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    Join date : 2009-06-21

    Re: 80/10/10

    Post  steviesun on Wed Jul 15, 2009 3:09 am

    I'm not quite as relaxed as Heather, but I do still work things out week by week. Spreadsheets are fun (if you're like me) but I reserve them for recording and calculating things like how much food I buy, how much I pay and therefore what my cost per kg and cost per day is. I like to have an idea so I can stay in budget and because as I'm becoming more open about how I feed it is one of the first questions that I get asked.
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    Kelly
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    Location : London, Ontario

    Re: 80/10/10

    Post  Kelly on Wed Jul 15, 2009 11:04 am

    We're like Heather.. the only things we make sure happen are bone/organ meals. Bone is every 2-3 days, and organ is once a week... one week liver, one week other (kidney right now).

    Everyone does raw differently, as long as you follow the general 80/10/10 you'd do fine. Very Happy


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    nbloch64

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    Join date : 2009-07-07
    Location : Denver, CO

    Re: 80/10/10

    Post  nbloch64 on Wed Jul 15, 2009 1:06 pm

    That is helpful. I have been giving bone every day and it sounds like that is not necessary. I can switch it up to every 2 or 3 days and provide meat on all days. They ate sardines packed in spring water last night and loved them! I will adjust the amounts of bone and meat accordingly, thank you.
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    Giselle

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    Join date : 2009-05-24
    Location : Cape May County, NJ

    Re: 80/10/10

    Post  Giselle on Wed Jul 15, 2009 7:34 pm

    Be aware, Nicole, that bone provides the bulk in a carnivore's diet - it firms poops.

    Since your dog is really new to raw, the absence of bone in meals may mean that you will see some really soft poops after feeding one or two meatymeat meals.

    Its not 'bad' and your guy wouldn't be sick - it's just normal when you feed varied bone-in, then boneless meals.

    My tendency is to recommend that a new to raw owner feed their dog a bit heavy on the bone, say 80% meat 20% bone, until they have successfully negotiated the intro of several new meats, over time and have also intro'd bits of liver into the feeding plan.

    Any new meat, or increase in fat content or organ ('specially liver) can mean that the poops will get soft, maybe even runny, until the dog and human are acclimated to what the dog can handle. Learning to feed to the dog's bowel tolerance is a new concept for most new-to-raw feeders. And, as the dog acclimates, his bowel tolerance can change.

    Pork, lamb, turkey, goat, all have larger, but still edible and digestible bones. Fish poops can be soft/runny, even when feeding whole fish. Adding bone-in chicken to the meat only parts can keep from the dog seesawing from too loose to too hard poops. And keep you from freaking out.
    And too, beef doesn't have any really edible digestible bones, so chicken comes in very handy when you intro it.

    I'm not saying don't - just be aware of the possibilities when planning to feed meatymeat meals.
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    nbloch64

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    Re: 80/10/10

    Post  nbloch64 on Thu Jul 16, 2009 2:50 pm

    I eased up on the bone and am switching to providing it every few days. Jedi has a ton more energy today and is not so lethargic and seems to be happier overall. I haven't seen any drastic change in their stools yet, but they were straining a bit previously so I was probably giving too much.

    Thank you for the heads up though. That is also good to know about the beef bones. They have been getting sardines every few nights and they absolutely love them. I mix in eggs a few times a week too, but they are still eating only chicken.
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    Timothea

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    Location : Kitchener Ontario

    Re: 80/10/10

    Post  Timothea on Fri Jul 17, 2009 11:06 am

    I don't try to balance EVERY meal with the 80/10/10 ratio, but I, like Heather, throw in organ once a week, normally following a really bony meal like chicken, which is closer to 40% bone than the 10% other prey animals seem to have.

    I look at her poops, chicken poops tend to be paler, and turn white within hours, but if they are crumbly coming out, she's getting too much bone. Liver and kidney, and heart all make the poops really dark, but too much and she gets runny, so I tend to feed those with turkey necks, and chickens, again to add more bone. Meat only meals are fine, I feed heart a lot on its own, but still watch the poops. If they get really loose, and slimy, then she may be having too many fatty meals, I have to watch that with the pork, so I add in leaner meats, more bone.

    This is also how I decide if she's getting enough to eat, if she gets too bony, then I've been skimping. If you can't feel your dog's ribs, she's getting too much, not anything I need to worry about, I can SEE my dog's ribs, and sometimes pointer owners get investigated for animal cruelty because people think we starve our dogs, but it's in their nature to be skinny, so I just have to worry about feeding ENOUGH, not TOO MUCH!

    As to egg, I give it once in a while as a treat, and try to remember to feed fish as a meal every few weeks or so to shine her coat up. It's like feeding yourself, if you write in a food diary, then great, manage your dog's food the same way, if you are more easygoing yourself, then play it by ear, no right or wrong to either method, as long as it works for you.
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    Heather

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    Age : 30
    Location : O'Fallon, MO

    Re: 80/10/10

    Post  Heather on Fri Jul 17, 2009 12:43 pm

    T, you reminded me!

    I forgot to mention when I feed organ I usually feed it with a meaty pork neck which is pretty high in bone but the only way I can intro some natural pork into the diet (they are from a local hog and not enhanced).


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